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Author Topic: Screaming Bell  (Read 15704 times)

Offline Huntsmen

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Screaming Bell
« on: May 22, 2007, 04:46:14 AM »
A friend of mine has recently returned from a overseas tourney which he won with his Skaven. His army list is very different to most other Skaven lists as he includes a Grey Seer and places him on the Screaming Bell. Now he has challenged me uses his winning list. Since i never played against one before and I don't have access to the Skaven book can some one tell me what a Screaming Bell dose beside giving the Grey Seer 3+ward and 3MR.
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Offline Burek

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Re: Screaming Bell
« Reply #1 on: May 22, 2007, 07:40:20 AM »
The skaven player can choose to ring the bell in his shooting phase using 1,2 or 3 dice:[ resulting in a variety of random effects]
However,should he roll a double,the effect applies,but the seer and the unit with the bell take [ a slight amount of damage ].
For a triple(treble),the effect doesn't apply,the bell is destroyed and the seer and the unit take [ more significant amounts of damage ] .

[ mod scrubbed for consistancy ]
« Last Edit: May 25, 2007, 03:39:50 PM by queek »

Offline Guvnor

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Re: Screaming Bell
« Reply #2 on: May 22, 2007, 08:06:56 AM »
It also has to be pushed by a unit, but can be targetted on its own as a large target. Randomising works the same as a chariot, so a 6 is needed to hit the grey seer.

I don't think the grey seer gets that 3+ ward save, just the bell, as the book states the ward save is for when missiles hit the indestructible bell. Still, if he fails it is dead like a normal chariot from s7+.

It also helps the unit carrying it by making them immune to psychology, except for bell effects.
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Offline Fandir Nightshade

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Re: Screaming Bell
« Reply #3 on: May 22, 2007, 09:23:20 AM »
if you shoot the bell with a cannonball doesn^t it ring the bell??

Offline Burek

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Re: Screaming Bell
« Reply #4 on: May 22, 2007, 09:32:07 AM »
Any attack with S7 or more,i don't think it's just shooting.

Offline Guvnor

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Re: Screaming Bell
« Reply #5 on: May 22, 2007, 10:13:19 AM »
That is if the ward save is passed.
I have one sentence in response to the engineer and mechanical: Empire is post-feudal age, not post-nuclear age!

Offline Ganymede

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Re: Screaming Bell
« Reply #6 on: May 22, 2007, 10:23:32 AM »
Also, remember that the strength five hit that riders recieve when the chariot is destroyed is no longer part of the rules, and that the beastie has MR 2, not MR3.

Offline Dendo Star

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Re: Screaming Bell
« Reply #7 on: May 22, 2007, 08:37:39 PM »
You know, that's bad.  But not so bad.  I expected something SO much worse!

Do you guys know what spells the Grey Seer has also?  I only know the Skaven get Warp Lightning.  :dry:

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Offline Burek

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Re: Screaming Bell
« Reply #8 on: May 22, 2007, 09:20:18 PM »
Ehh...vermintide,skitterleap...plague?I don't know now,i don't have my handbook with me :p

Offline Wyzer1

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Re: Screaming Bell
« Reply #9 on: May 22, 2007, 10:06:06 PM »
The bell is totally BS in my opinion. If it were 500+ pts, sure

Problem is the damn thing is what? Like 100 pts?

Absolute crap. The worst thing is when they skaven player then takes a SAD army with it though

I really am not sure the best way to deal with it. I forget, does it make the unit it is with unbreakable or stubborn?
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Offline BAWTRM

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Re: Screaming Bell
« Reply #10 on: May 23, 2007, 07:13:10 AM »
That nr. 8 result can be absolutely horrible so keep your cavalry units in the front!

I had a first turn nr. 8 result against me (his turn 1, I hadn't moved yet) and both my IC WW knights as a unit of Pistoliers with champion decided to run of the battlefield, which left an entire flank open and saw a large number of VP run off.
I managed to claw back to a minor loss in the end (also because he destroyed his own bell) but it was an uphill battle all the way!
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Offline Davido

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Re: Screaming Bell
« Reply #11 on: May 23, 2007, 10:13:09 AM »
That damn bell. It's 300 pts on top of the grey seer and the seer gets 360 degree line of sight for magic., your scouting huntsmen just got splatted by warplightning. Also beware skitterleap. It is an absolute pain in the arse, the seer can teleport any skaven character within 18 inches and put him anywhere on the board. This is often used to teleport a warlock engineer who once teleported behind say your knights or artilery can spit out a warp lightning sometimes 2 if he has a particular magic item. Not very nice. This bell is ussually used in a small skaven army only about 140 of the bastards at 2500pts. However the army will have the grey seer and 3 three warlocks. This translates to a 15 pd magic phase which I have never managed to nullify. Also he will have jezzails which are range 36 str 6 and armour piercing.

Good luck against the rats.
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Offline Fandir Nightshade

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Re: Screaming Bell
« Reply #12 on: May 23, 2007, 10:16:49 AM »
How about having a large unit of Menghils walking in front of your army?

Offline Wyzer1

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Re: Screaming Bell
« Reply #13 on: May 23, 2007, 03:25:25 PM »
Just played with one today, allied of skaven and empire vs lizardmen... whatev

We forgot to ring the damn thing two turns in a row, but we crushed him anyways. Also my pts values were wayyy off.. Its more than I thought it was, but either way its really nasty
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Offline Steve-O

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Re: Screaming Bell
« Reply #14 on: May 23, 2007, 05:55:08 PM »
The bell becomes uber nasty in big games, because its results effect the entire enemy force.  I played in a 24k point mega battle, and one of my opponents had the bell.  Simply put, it was the MVP of the game.
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Offline Hochland Hero

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Re: Screaming Bell
« Reply #15 on: May 23, 2007, 07:02:29 PM »
Quote
The bell is totally BS in my opinion. If it were 500+ pts, sure

Problem is the damn thing is what? Like 100 pts?
no the bell with a fuul equiped greyseer is probably arround 450 -500 points but i agree if it was 100 that would be bad

Edit: Whoops my bad Wyzer1
« Last Edit: May 25, 2007, 06:04:51 AM by Hochland Hero »
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Offline Wyzer1

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Re: Screaming Bell
« Reply #16 on: May 23, 2007, 09:39:36 PM »
Quote
The bell is totally BS in my opinion. If it were 500+ pts, sure

Problem is the damn thing is what? Like 100 pts?
no the bell with a fuul equiped greyseer is probably arround 450 -500 points but i agree if it was 100 that would be bad
Thats why two posts later I corrected myself...
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Offline Volkbane

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Re: Screaming Bell
« Reply #17 on: May 24, 2007, 01:56:59 PM »
I always wondered how the bell worked in mega-games.  Strictly by the book, of course, it effects everything.  You can also see multiple screaming bells in games like that ringing in the same turn.  I always thought they should have a zone of control--a large one, like 60" or something, but not indefinate (Imagine one on a 20 footer table at Games Day).

If the bell is destroyed it is  pretty catastrophic--the seer no longer takes the str5 hit as mentioned but both he and his unit take multiple hits in addition to that.  The bell also causes impact hits as per chariots when the unit charges.

The grey seer can cast skitterleap, warp lightning, vermintide, pestilent breath, death frenzy, and plague.  Death frenzy is a particularly fun spell because your opponent will probably use it to draw out your dispel dice and you, probably wisely, will ignore it in favor of warp lighting and plague--and before you know it he's charging you with a disposable unit of 2-point slaves with 3 attacks each.  He can also use it on his weapon teams to make them immune to psychology without liability (since they can never charge anyway).

The grey seer doesn't get a ward save--he gets a 5+ save from the carriage and the option to hide out of sight on it if challenged.  If something str7+ gets through the bell's ward save it will destroy it like any other chariot and cause havok on the unit.  If the grey seer is killed, the bell and bell-ringer can continue on. 

It's definately spooky but in my experience a simple warlord with a rusted halberd is a better choice.  The skaven will have a bubble of LD10 coming at you as well as enough points saved to create an extra battle line of slaves with hard units mixed in.

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Offline Ganymede

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Re: Screaming Bell
« Reply #18 on: May 24, 2007, 04:16:01 PM »
He can also use [Death Frenzy] on his weapon teams to make them immune to psychology without liability (since they can never charge anyway).




If he does such, the weapon teams can no longer stand-and-shoot against chargers. I'd call that a liability.

Offline thatdave

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Re: Screaming Bell
« Reply #19 on: May 24, 2007, 07:38:17 PM »

The grey seer can cast skitterleap, warp lightning, vermintide, pestilent breath, death frenzy, and plague.  Death frenzy is a particularly fun spell because your opponent will probably use it to draw out your dispel dice and you, probably wisely, will ignore it in favor of warp lighting and plague--and before you know it he's charging you with a disposable unit of 2-point slaves with 3 attacks each.  He can also use it on his weapon teams to make them immune to psychology without liability (since they can never charge anyway).


I usually only ran one unit of slaves, but I armed them with spears - and cast Death Frenzy on them all the time.  That would be 30 attacks on a non-charging turn!!

And Plague is fantastic as well, especially against lower Toughness armies.  I killed 45-55 Night Goblins in one turn (from 3 different units) with this spell.  I also eliminated ~1/3 of a High Elf army in the first turn with it (not much fun that) by it moving from unit to unit. 

I have also lost a few games to my opponent being able to direct the Plague against my units, so can go both ways.

Offline jullevi

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Re: Screaming Bell
« Reply #20 on: May 24, 2007, 08:15:19 PM »
He can also use [Death Frenzy] on his weapon teams to make them immune to psychology without liability (since they can never charge anyway).




If he does such, the weapon teams can no longer stand-and-shoot against chargers. I'd call that a liability.

Why is that? Units Immune to Psychology cannot flee from charges, but they sure can Stand and shoot. Undead are an exception to this, because they have a special rule saying that they may only Hold as a charge reaction.

By the way, I don't think that empire players have much reason to complain about underpriced generals' chariots..
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Offline Volkbane

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Re: Screaming Bell
« Reply #21 on: May 25, 2007, 01:35:24 AM »
Quote
By the way, I don't think that empire players have much reason to complain about underpriced generals' chariots..

Aye, the screaming bell is twice the price of the war altar, is not unbreakable, does not give its rider a ward save, gives the same level of magic resistance, gives 2 extra power die instead of the extra bound spell--has a movement rate of 5" when being pushed, no mount attacks, no armor save in addition to its ward.  It can ring, which to be honest is sometimes a let down or total disaster (though admittedly a fun threat to employ).  I don't find the bell to be that intimidating, and as a Skaven player I abandoned it after a brief love affair early on.
« Last Edit: May 25, 2007, 01:37:27 AM by Volkbane »
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Offline Empireguard

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Re: Screaming Bell
« Reply #22 on: May 25, 2007, 01:45:31 AM »
The grey seer doesn't get a ward save--he gets a 5+ save from the carriage

doesn't he get a 2+ armour save? As per the new chariot rules
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Offline Ganymede

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Re: Screaming Bell
« Reply #23 on: May 25, 2007, 03:33:16 AM »
He can also use [Death Frenzy] on his weapon teams to make them immune to psychology without liability (since they can never charge anyway).




If he does such, the weapon teams can no longer stand-and-shoot against chargers. I'd call that a liability.

Why is that? Units Immune to Psychology cannot flee from charges, but they sure can Stand and shoot. Undead are an exception to this, because they have a special rule saying that they may only Hold as a charge reaction.

Stealth Change!!!

In 6th edition, units who were immune to psychology could only ever hold as a charge reaction. After a quick check, it looks like this has been changed.

Offline Warlord

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Re: Screaming Bell
« Reply #24 on: May 25, 2007, 05:20:54 AM »
What about using the bell against a Steam Tank?

Do you think it takes 4D6 wounds, or does it not get damaged - because it's not Toughness 7?

(I could be rusty in the rules, I haven't gone against a Bell in a few years)
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